Wincest "When" Poll

[lovesrain44]

[Poll #1286101]

Comments

[lovesrain44.livejournal.com]

I meant to add....please feel free to add links to fic that proves your theory!!

[lupina78.livejournal.com]

Hey!! *waves*
Just stopping by bc of your very interesting poll!! *giggles*
Me has votet!! gg
What a great idea for a poll! Thanks for it!!

*greetings from Austria*

[lovesrain44.livejournal.com]

Thank you for voting! Which one were you and why? (Just curious...)

[ckll.livejournal.com]

I voted for the third option although i suspect that something may happened before Sam goes college

[lovesrain44.livejournal.com]

I like this....do you have any particularly good fic to rec that goes along with this idea?

[lovesrain44.livejournal.com]

Hey, thanks! I got a paid account as a gift and one of the funnest things has been these polls!

I think there's lots of different points at which wincest could have occurred...one of my pet ideas is that if the thought entered their minds before John came on the scene, his arrival put the kibosh on the whole thing, but this only intensitfied it for them. Personally? I think it happened after John died, even if underaged stuff happened, his death would have been a catalyst and a release.

[kitsu84.livejournal.com]

To tell you the truth, I have no clue. But I will admit to laughing at this poll. XD

Alright, fine... I'll taka stab at it and say the next to last option. Can you imagine how hot and utterly heart-breaking that would've been?

[lovesrain44.livejournal.com]

Oooooooooooooh! Very angsty! And cruel! I like it! Let me know if you run across any fic like this, eh?

[alwaysenduphere.livejournal.com]

Wow. I can honestly say I've never actually tried to pinpoint the spot when I thought Sam and Dean became SamnDean. It's one of those..."eh, just happened" type things.

[lovesrain44.livejournal.com]

That's okay. I'm just anal like that...had some thoughts, and wondered what othere people thought. Did you vote, then? Nor no?

[lfg1986.livejournal.com]

Lol, I think you had the right idea here w/ the poll. I've actually asked my very flist this same question many times, but I did it more of a general question, not giving poll options, so I never got any clear answer. But I have to say, I really think it could be SEVERAL of these options. I voted for right after season 2, after Dean makes his deal, just cause I think that was a turning point for both of the boys. They both had to realize and come to terms w/ just how much they were willing to sacrifice for the other. I think Dean always knew he WOULD, but the fact that he DID probably in turn made Sam see things in a new way about his brother. And poor Dean, he was so glad to have Sam back, I'm sure it would have been easy to go to that next level w/ Sam at that point.

My second vote would be right after Mystery Spot, when Sam finally realized what Dean must have gone through when Sam died, and he in turn was so desperate to have Dean back, that things could have very easily escalated once Dean was back w/ him. Same thing w/ right after 4.01, except the way Sam's been behaving this season, I'm not really thinking that would be the case. He seems far too detached right now, as opposed to Mystery Spot.

[lovesrain44.livejournal.com]

Well, how nice of you to say! I've been wondering this question myself for some time, and like you, have not gotten a satisfactory answer. My first responses indicated to me that how dare I even try and make this issue canon, and then I was reminded that wincest was NOT canon...which completely misses the point! So I've waited till I could figure LJ out and ask the question in the right way....hence this poll.

I love the logic you apply to your answer, and your description of why. The key thing you point out here is escalation - which is an important factor in their relationship. If they're not already having sex, then something external would bring them together. Either, like you say, Dean's deal, or Sam's misery during Mystery Spot.

(PS, I love your icon!!)

[chasingtides.livejournal.com]

I think that it would be one of those gradual things. They were living in each other's pockets, learning to rely upon each other again, losing the people they loved, and somehow they would realise that they loved each other and could depend upon each other and always have each other. (So, yeah, probably before All Hell Breaks Loose.) And I think it would be so gradual that you couldn't pin point one spot.

[lovesrain44.livejournal.com]

Yes, I can see this....but even if it's a gradual growth into wincest for them, there had to have been something to push them over into it, some last little step...lots of different theories, of course!

[raynelove.livejournal.com]

i voted for "Before the Pilot, Dean went out to Stanford and, well, things just happened." because i like to think they only realized they cannot live without each other when they were apart for the first time ;D

[lovesrain44.livejournal.com]

This is a lovely answer!!! They were so randy when they were young...

[mulanreflection]

Hahah. Awesome.

But no 'all of the above' option?? Cause. Dude. totally. <.< ALL OF THE ABOVE.

[lovesrain44.livejournal.com]

Any and ALL! Yeah! I'm up for any point in the series being THE point!!
And fanfic to go with it....

[jim-t-kirk.livejournal.com]

OMG! I wanted to vote for so many! You could make it with multiple choices... really :)
Great pool!

[lovesrain44.livejournal.com]

I tried messing with it, but decided on this way, because if I did multiple choice, then the numbers wouldn't come out so clearly like they are here.....and the whole underage thing, whew! That surely surprised me. : D And I'm glad you enjoyed the poll, they're fun to do!

[jessicamee.livejournal.com]

it's ALWAYS been there. :D

but speaking seriously, Sam definitely tried things during those Tuesdays where Dean kept dying. if he could do anything without it affecting what was going to happen, hell why not? and yes, this is me speaking seriously. lol.

[lovesrain44.livejournal.com]

Interesting....I like the idea of Sam experimenting out of a sense of desperation, but what do you think would have pushed him to try it the first time?

[domina-malfoy.livejournal.com]

What can I say? Underage Wincest wins every time ;P

[lovesrain44.livejournal.com]

It's so terribly strange to me that it does, but it does! When I was driving home last night I was trying to come up with the "why" of this, but then got distracted thinking of all the porny stories I read.....

[korusialhogi.livejournal.com]

Well, kids will be kids! After all you can't seriously expect two hotties to live together in confined space and wait for like 18 years to start fucking:)
I like your polls! a lot!

[lovesrain44.livejournal.com]

Hey, thank you! They're fun to do! Because there's no wrong or right here, but I was sure surprised to find out how many people don't agree with me! (I went for the after ELAC...)

The whole underage thing probably started as fooling around...and then it stopped when Sam went away...and then took a bit of time, but started up again. Yeah?

[keks80.livejournal.com]

*whines* How am I supposed to make a decision here? It's all possible.

[keks80.livejournal.com]

Here, have some links that prove the 'It's all possible', in no specific order and without the fancy linking thing because I'm too lazy:
http://fleshflutter.livejournal.com/26432.html
http://astolat.livejournal.com/168504.html
http://community.livejournal.com/omg_fics/15767.html
http://destina.livejournal.com/363746.html
http://community.livejournal.com/leonidasden/10510.html
http://memphis86.livejournal.com/24371.html
http://fleshflutter.livejournal.com/9573.html
http://community.livejournal.com/leonidasden/11004.html
http://lemmealone.livejournal.com/282010.html
http://causeways.livejournal.com/49380.html
http://sadelyrate.livejournal.com/38872.html
http://dreamlittleyo.livejournal.com/10931.html
http://hansbekhart.livejournal.com/216820.html
http://veronamay.livejournal.com/465638.html
http://community.livejournal.com/leonidasden/26113.html

[charmedstrange1.livejournal.com]

I voted for pre-series because my perverted mind likes to belieeeeeeeeve it. *eg*

No, srsly, by the time Sam left for Stanford, he was, you know, EIGHTEEN. Mostly kinda grown, and out of the annoy-your-brother stage. Well, almost. Anyhow, I daydream think that because they were so close, living in each other's pockets, not having any (or very few) other *constant* relationships outside their little triad-- and the fact that they are both smokin hot-- means yeah, they got busy before Sam left for college.

I dunno. I just kind of like the idea that Sam was always a little bit in love with his big brother. :) And that Dean always loved Sam more than life, and once Sam got old enough to be seen as sexy (by whatever standard one might view for that), that Dean started to see him that way too (even tho he was riddled with guilt, natch)... that may be squicky for some people, I know. But that's my fav wincest story.

If I had to pick an episode? It'd be the one where Dean and Sam have the conversation in the hotel room when they've just reunited with Dad, and Sam talks about things almost being over, and him going back to school- and Dean's all 'it'll never be over, Sam'- and how he wants them to be a family again- and "Why do you think I drag you all over the country Sammy?"-- yeah. Dean is just so-- wincesty right there. Even tho Sam sticks to his guns, Sam had to think it over and go and comfort Dean right? Right? :P

Oh! And here's my link - exhibits A and B ;)

http://drvsilla.livejournal.com/11245.html - "Fix(ation)"
http://shea-fleur.livejournal.com/69706.html#cutid1 - "Trust Me"

[lovesrain44.livejournal.com]

Oooh, I love answsers like this! And the links too, thank you!

So you're saying the wincest happened later during the pre series time, rather than earlier. So like...16 for Sam?

I like your theory that Sam was always a little bit in love with Dean - and of course, yes, Dean, there's nothing he wouldn't do for Sam. What I like about this pairing, regardless of the age, is that each of them comes equipped with not only a whole lot of baggage, plus that baggage is different, but each of them is as vulnerable to the other. Except for Evil!Sam stories, where Sam's control and darkness makes sense, most stories I read have them unbending to each other, once they get started they don't hold back. THere's a lot of love there, even if it is squicky. : D

As for the EP you pick? That has ALWAYS been one of my favorite scenes, Wincesty to the max, because Dean is coming clean here, he's opening up. Only I don't think Sam realizes how rare this is and is going to be. So I don't think the wincest happened THEN, however, it was certainly a starting point....

[pbfate.livejournal.com]

What about during Season Four! Right after Dean comes back and they both realize what life without the other is like and therefore want to have no regrets when one of them eventually bites the dust (again!)
Not that I've put a lot of thought into that... ¬_¬
lol, I love polls.

[lovesrain44.livejournal.com]

I really have left season four out of the equation, havne't I. Doesn't mean it's not a viable selection, that's for sure. I guess I'm not as familiar with this season's eps to be able to mull them over and go, "Well, THAT was surely a time wincest could have happened!"

got the best ones right here

[iwrotethissong.livejournal.com]

All of these fics (http://www.livejournal.com/tools/memories.bml?user=candle_beck&keyword=no+particular+direction--supernatural&filter=own) are ridiculously believable.

Love this poll, love how promising this comm is looking.

x helen

Re: got the best ones right here

[lovesrain44.livejournal.com]

You are a fan after my own heart. Everything candlebeck writes is touched with gold and flash and sparkle and a whole lotta steak to go with that. Candlebeck GETS it, way down deep, the elements of these two character and sells me on it each and every time. Thank you for these links!

[aki-san.livejournal.com]

I voted for S2, after John died, but I have a few pet theories on how it all could have gone down:

1) Pre-series adolescent sex that didn't resume (at least not immediately) after they hit the road in S1, and those actions kind of hang over them like a black cloud and color their relationship throughout the show. Eventually though, I think in this scenario they'd reach a breaking point and start fucking again.

2) After "Children Shouldn't Play With Dead Things", where they're on the side of that mountain and Dean admits that he knows that John must have sold his soul for him, and he says to Sam, "What could you possibly say to make that all right?". Obviously, Sam can't SAY anything, but that line begs the question too much for me to think that nothing happened after it!

3) Sex sometimes happens after periods of high stress and too many close-calls, but they never talk about it. I think of this as the denial scenario.

4) Sam is totally, consciously in unrequited love with Dean, and Dean might be in love with him too subconsciously, but it's buried under too many layers of needing to protect Sam, even from himself. There's no sex happening in this scenario, but I think it might secretly be my favorite because it's so tragic.

[velvetine01.livejournal.com]

1) Pre-series adolescent sex that didn't resume (at least not immediately) after they hit the road in S1, and those actions kind of hang over them like a black cloud and color their relationship throughout the show. Eventually though, I think in this scenario they'd reach a breaking point and start fucking again.

This is my personal canon and seems to be, IMO the most realistic of the ones where they actually end up together, though your n4 is probably the most realistic overall. I like to think that it took a while to heal old wounds and become as comfortable with each other as they were before. I'm sure they missed each other like nobody's business, but both had a serious relationship in between and it's just hard to go back to this. Though I think later it becomes apparent to them that it was inevitable. *feels shippy*

I totally stand behind your number 4 too. I rarely think that the canon Dean could stop being himself for long enough to realise what's between him and Sam. And should he ever, I think his guilt and emotions would destroy him and maybe he'd end up running away. Yes, tragic, angsty brothers do something for me.

[anacothouse.livejournal.com]

yeah,i think something happened before sam went to college,maybe that was one of the reasons,you know sam freaked out and left because he realized he was in love with his brother or something like that

[vampyreranger.livejournal.com]

I think it was like two days before NRftW. I've always said that Dean should have/maybe did spend that last week having hot gay incestuous sex with his brother. He's going to hell, how much worse can it get?! But feelings were there all along.